9 years ago
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Please have a look in the tricks forum: I'm explaining my doubts there. I'm trying to learn helico on my Mentor 3. The deep stall is not as easy as on other wings, seen on youtube, or is it just me?
I'm in Oludeniz right now, so any fast help will be appreciated!
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Hi,
I never did deep stalls with a non-acro glider -- I am too scared ;-)
Anyways, what helped me most was breaking quickly and progressively, instead of waiting somewhere for the glider to stall. This way it is easier for me to feel the stall point and to stall symmetrically. Additionally stalling quickly lets you keep some speed and the glider will stall behind you, so you can just release a bit and then catch the wing over your head.
In the end it takes a lot of practice, but at some point you will just get that feeling ;-)
Cheers,
Geri
Good progress today after applying a lot of the good tips that I got on the forum, via email and from Semi, a local Turkish instructor. I managed to do deep stalls with less brake as follows:
1. Lock legs under seat
2. Pull brakes until brake pressure drops away.
3. Instead of highering the brakes 5 cm in an uncontrolled way, I now just grab the risers, without noticeably highering the brakes. I wait a second until the pitch movement is gone.
4. I slowly glide my hands up the risers, and sometimes stay in deep stall with 20cm less brake than before.
5. Once, I felt well and I ended up with the brakes in an assymetric position.
6. My first accidental helico did 2 rotations. Tomorrow I'll try to do it on purpose...
Hi,
I´m just figuring the deepstall out by myself, what i noticed on your video: your bodyposition, your glider deforming, asymmetry of your brakes...
Now what helps me perform the deepstall:
1. Relaxed but not spread body position( by that I mean my legs are far apart but locked under my seat, my upper body relaxed in posture)
2. When stalling I try not to deform the glider (I know the mentor is going to deform due to it´s streched design, it´s going to stall the tips first, so be prepared for that)
3. At the beginning I recommend you to hold your risers to check the symmetry of your brakes (for example on my wing my deepstall point is in the hight of the higher acceleration sheap) Of course you shouldn´t hold on your riser till you lose control, don´t forget to release... basically keep an eye on what your hands are doing, if your sure your brakes are symmetrical and your glider starts to turn anyways then you´ll know your body is asymmetrical.
Don´t give up, it is possible!
I hope my words are helpfull.
Good Flights!
Sorry. First sentence correction: I was still in deep stall when releasing the brakes almost fully.
The only references I have up to now are the youtube movie of someone trying a helico with a mentor 2, which falls back into fullstall after 2 rotations, and the fact that someone on this forum replied to my topic in the tricks section that helico's are possible with a mentor 3.
OK, Many thanks! I've practiced deep stalls with my Gradient Freestyle 2 and UP Edge, and that felt just as you descibed: I was able to go in deep stall and release my brakes almost completely, and still be in full stall. With the Mentor 3, it gives me a completely different feeling: It's harder to initiate the stall, it's harder to keep in stall and my hands are too low.
I'll give it 15 more attempts to deep stall the Mentor 3 properly, with max 10 cm brake. (now it's like 50 cm). If that doesn't work, I'll take out my freestyle 2 and start over again: Fullstalls, backflies, deep stalls, and hopefully some first helico's. They don't need to be perfect yet. I just want to build the confidence.
You have to understand that it takes years of practice to preform nice helicopters. It is going to be very hard for you to hold a deep stall with a Mentor 3 first off.
I think going forward you should try and fly the deep stall with less break, (30-40mm)
if this works out for you then try spin the glider. your positive break should be fully released and after you spin the glider the negative side break should only be held on just enough to keep it spinning, again 20-30 mm at most. don't try and spin the glider with both breaks around your carabiners.
remember that if anything goes wrong go back into a full stall and fly out.
Hi, Frenchy. What you say makes perfect sense to me, but in the movie I'm not trying to helico yet. I'm trying to do deep stalls first. Can you have a look at the text below (also posted by me in the forum/tricks and give your comments.
Hi, I'm in Oludeniz now, and did 4 flights:
1. Practice fullstalls and backflies. Fully confident with those now.
2. Unsuccesful attempts to deep stall. Not mentally ready yet, and boat was not available.
3. Deep stall attempts: 30% succesful, but quite short: 1-2 seconds max
4. Deep stalls: 80% succesful, some 2-3 seconds (I posted a few in the movie)
If I compare the postion of my brakes in deep stall to almost all youtube movies of other gliders, I have the impression that my hands have to stay very low to keep my mentor 3 in deep stall.
I want to know if it's OK to try to spin the glider and if I should keep my hands around this very low deep stall position, or raise them like on youtube. This is how it goes up to now:
1. I fly straight, without oscillations.
2 I slowly brake the glider, as if I were going to fullstall it
3. When the brake pressure drops, I lift my hands about 5 cm to keep the wing from fullstalling. (If I lift them higher, I believe the wing will escape from the deep stall).
4. There, the brake pressure becomes unstable: the brakes pull my hands with small shocks, but I fight it, to stay in deep stall as long as possible.
5. So: I'm not able to fly the deepstall with low brake pressure.
My question: What should I do next:
a. TRy to fly deepstall with less brake pressure and my hands higher up? How to do that? I have the feeling that the glider wants to escape from deep stall then.
b. The deepstall is OK. I can just try to spin it with my hands at karabiner height instead of hands almost up.
c. The deepstall is OK, but when I start to spin it, I should lift my hands higher so that the helico will look like all youtube movies...
What do you think?
There are many factors in why you are unable to preform a hellico. Have you built your skill base up before trying a Helli, (spinning your glider ect?) by the looks of things you are not releasing your breaks fast enough when your wing enters a deep stall. and once its over your head you are not giving enough break input to spin your glider. A major factor would also be the wing you are flying, why not try hellico on a freestyle? DVH1 wings can be hard to Helli.