Trying to Heli - getting worse :-( Please help !

Dear all

I try to learn heli

First 2 Helis were easy and smooth
Since then, it get worse
The harder I try, the worse it gets :-(

Glider: Ozone Octane2 22
Harness: Supair Acro Base

What I try to do:

- upright position
- pull down both brakes to slow down glider until stall-point
- release both brakes
- pull both breaks again a second later once glider is over my head
- release outside break (left), and pull inside break (right)

There are 2 possibilities

either I do not pull hard enough, then I directly enter into a SAT
or I pull too much, then it gets some asymmetric *ugly* negative spin, glider partly closed, but no heli :-(

Any help or thoughts??

Is there and possibility to test the correct timing, speed and strength of break input??

Thanks a lot!!


Latest Comments

sven.haller's picture

Dear Experts

After countless (!) frustrating attempts I finally manage to get a more or less helico-like state

Any tips or suggestions to further improve are highly appreciated


sven.haller's picture

Dear Stefan and all

Thanks for the help!

Yesterday I was at Annecy, unfortunately not possible to get a lot of altitude for training but I could at least train a little bit

@ Stefan: I made exactly the same things with the breaks. I shortened, the I removed the little attachments (don't know how they are called) to have only the break line without this "attachments", now I am back to factory setting but about 5cm shorter

Yesterday it finally got better

I now made a more pronounced "stop" second movement with both hands after the first movement "stall point". It gave a much better and more controlled spin into the heli

Some questions

- for the second "stop" movement, what is the best timing and how strong is the break force (i.e. similar to a tight turn, or really *full* force?

- after this second "stop" movement and before the starter, do you completely release both breaks or do you "keep" the internal break down?

- what is the timing for the "starter", how much break force? Do you pull hard at the beginning to initiate the heli and then immediately release or keep the same break pressure? Where do you put the weight ? I have the impression that if I do weight too much to the internal side, then I immediately go into a SAT

Thanks for your comment !!

I do not have a go pro, so no videos :-( But will try to get hold of one !


stefkopp's picture

Hi Sven,
very interesting to hear about your experiences. I have an Octane 2/22 as well and I'm also training helicos... And, guess what, I also had some early successes (first helicos were not perfect but OK) and then things seemed to get more difficult...
In my case, I changed brake setup several times. I'm also training McTwists and for those, I had to shorten brakes. Long story short, I now have classic brake handles (not acro handles) because (in my opinion and for my setup) there is way you can do spin tricks like McTwist without taking at least one wrap on the brake -- and taking wraps is much easier weith classic brake handles.
About your question, my brakes are now (without taking a wrap) still shorter than factory setup -- but only by approx. 10 cm. And I found that deep stall is a bit easier again.
Another thing I found is, it is better to enter qickly... In my early attempts, I slowed the glider to minimum speed, then took quote some time to stall it completely... From what I have heard and seen on other peoples videos, it is better to go from trim speed to stall in something like 2 seconds. Also, let the canopy drop a LITTLE bit before releasing the brakes to get it back over your head. Otherwise, the glider often picks up speed again, sometimes barely noticable...
Most important of all, if the glider starts to oscillate (in helico or in deep stall), pull it back into flyback. I touched my canopy more than once by loosing patience and trying to force it (trying to get an oscillating deep stall calmed down). Even of the oscillation may not feel bad, the glider is just waiting for it to be in line with the canopy (you swing forward, canopy is behind). The followinhg oscillation can be quite a surprising shoot and as a newcomer to helicos, looking at the canopy, once you see the horizon come up next to the glider, it is too late to stop the shoot. Learning: If you see the ears come forwards (your glider drops back), pull it into flyback.
So much for my current thoughts... Take it as preliminary, as I'm still training and most attempts come out very crappy! :-)
Let us know about your findings! As I wrote, I have the same glider, and I'd love to hear about any wisdom you pick up along the way!
Take care and fly safe...

Martini's picture

go practice deepstall/parachutals!
when you do nice deepstalls you simply lean and break a little more to one side to initiate the rotation, if you do that right the heli will stable then you simply lean to the positive side to continue the rotation.

Send a video so we can analyze better your mistakes.

Best regards, Fly safe!

sven.haller's picture

Thanks for the comment!

The point is that apparently something is wrong in my timing.
But I do not know what. So I do also not know what I could do to improve :-(

slyski's picture

Hi Sven,

It looks like you have the best possible glider to learn the heli and you know the fundamentals how to heli.
Now you just need to practice, practice and more practice.

When you learn how to heli in the beginning don't try to correct it, if it goes ugly from the start exit immediately.