@ Joerg: I fly the 17m2 with 90 kg take-off weight (but I could easily fly a bigger one too).
Ricky Kahn flies a 20m2 Thriller with about 105 kg take-off weight and does perfect Rythmic SATs, Infinities!
Go for the biggest size possible, you will have fun and learn safer/faster/easier than with a smaller, aggressiver glider!
@Idiot: I just had a PPG show on the weekend, flying a 22m2 Thriller. This gives me about the same kg/m2 as flying the 17m2 solo (my motor with rescue and petrol weights about 40 kg). It was so much fun, but I was only doing the basics tricks like WO, SAT, helicopter. I did many helico to helicos too, hihihi, I guess it was never done with paramotor before :-)
Anyhow, as soon as the 24m2 comes out I think I will take that one because there is really no need for the small size, since it is dynamic enough anyway...For the Paramotor version there probably must be some small changes like a longer trimmer for better speeds on straight flights.
ciao
It is such a good news.
I'm ~140 kg all up and there is no free style glider in the market for PPG pilots.
I can use smaller gliders but they simply do not have the high G capacity.
You guys can give a lot of feedback to manufacturers, please let them know that we do not have a PPG free style glider in the market.
Thanks for the answer!
So is my interpretation correct that flying the 22m2 with 120kg is totally over the top? That would mean that other gliders like the Supersonic, the Nikita or the RR wings are small for me, too? What a shame...
cheers, joerg
Just have a little patience and soon the Thriller 24m2 will come out! It is gonna be just the perfect toy for pilots with some basics acro experience and heavier guys to fly radical stuff but safe!
There are some small new developments in the inner structure of the canopy to make it even stronger and give longer life to the wing.
Yeeeehaw!
I've got an answer and since over 2 month I fly my thriller 20 :). I can only say I love this wing !!! My first acro glider
and feels like I made a great choice but... it concerns ONLY myself.Some of the best acro pilots seen my films and my skill's level so was much easier to get a good advice.Also my learning ability is quite high and I knew I will manage . I guess it's difficult to give any advice without seeing pilot in the air...What I can say I will recommend thriller for guys they fly basic acro manouvers well including FULL STALLS( very well)!!!
If it comes to the size...well,trust your feelings and skills :)
at what wing load do you guys fly the thriller (or other acro gliders)?
I'm a tall guy and have around 118kg takeoff weight. Looking at the wing load tables that is too much for all the acro gliders out there... or are those tables on the safe side to make less experienced pilots choose bigger gliders?
It says that even in the grey range the wing is able to perform the infinity tumbling. Is it really possible?
My take off weight is about 100 kg and I'm considering the Thriller in size 22 (wing loading would be 4,55-4,77 kg/m^2) but only if it would be possible to do the infinity tumbling.
On Icaro's website you can read that the Nikita II is able to make all today's manoeuvres when the wing loading is at least 5 kg/m^2.
Can someone experienced answer - what is the minimal wing loading necessary for the infinity?
Thx :)
PS. bernd - how do you find the Thriller compared to the Morpheus II? Is it more dynamic? How's the helico on M II?
I still work for them, but anyway I would like to have the answer from people who's actually flying, then I can compare with what the "official word" says. I saw Bernd's Yellow/Grey Morpheus 2, and he says it have complete Kevlar Lineset. This tells me something... Or not? Someone who flew both versions (Dyneema and Kevlar), could tell me something? Thanks and best regards to all!
I'm ordering a Thriller 18 for me, should I ask for special lines? What's the difference on the glider if I ask complete Kevlar line set? Will it be the same safety? More durable for stretching and shrinking? Thanks!
Hi David
Yo- I don't doubt it after this forum discussion, but if you had read from the beginning- I haven't had the best experiences from U-Turn which lead me to not believe in this product. 4sure It's been good to hear from pilots!! :-D
Hi mikesm08,
It's my footage you see on vimeo. I just want to try to explain my first feelings about the thriller . I did only 4 flights with it, but I'm already very impressed. First of all, I've usually many problems with helico, but with the thriller it's easier because the parachutage is very stable, and the wing stay always just above the head. For the rythmic, the brake is lighter than others acro wings and the glider keep high pressure, despite my low weight (65kg). I advise you to test it and you'll quickly understand that it's probably the best acro glider you have ever flown!
Thanx Pal and Bernd for the videos.
I found this on vimeo, it's not the best footage but you can see the shape of the wing, longer lines etc> http://www.vimeo.com/7144599
It will definitely be interesting if the EAS evolves into something in the future...
If you already have some basic acro experience I would definitely suggest you to try a 22m2 version of the Thriller! It will have the same characteristics like an acro glider (easy handling, great dynamics, blabla), but without the agression of it. The dynamic figures are never a problem, they will only get much much easier for you. But you need to re-learn to perform nice full-stalls cleanly! First learn to make perfecft tail-slides with your current glider and it's going fine, you are ready to move up and adopt your skills on an acro glider in the beginning over water.
Hope that helps...
Hi guys!
I really hope you are not gonna say"F..ck,another one again" ;D but my question is if the Thriller might be good as a first acro glider.Since two seasons I fly Sigma 6 and I do really high and clean wingovers ,SAT with no flapping wingtips and asymetric spiral. I don't know so much about acro yet ;) but I don't want to jump on 2 hot wing from the beginning like G-force or Morpheus is.Where the Thriller is placed compare to those?
Thanks for understanding to a rookie :))).Regards
Very nice synchro video. I know the switchy tumbling is nothing new but i think its a rare stuff to see in acro videos thats why i was impressed. Need to try this one on my Nikita :-)
There is another one, synchro this time, unfortunately without helico action.
Both Tumblings were quite nicely synchronized, thanks to that now is flying one m2 bigger than I.
Next time when I have the possibility I'll record an only-helico-to-helico training flight... ;-)
Till then: http://www.justacro.com/video/justacro/freestyleair-2nd-synchro-run
After the helico exit when I enter the first tumbling I use no rythmic moves (I didn't want to make it too high, because wanted to exit in classical way to enter the second one), I only release the brake back up a bit, not to loose energy. It easily does 2-3 turns, if you don't pull too much brake. Coming out from the first one I already have more energy for the second, so I am able to wait longer to enter and then I used some rythmic to get it straight up and exit symmetric, like from an infinity. It is called switchy tumbling and it is not a new thing, however with nowadays acro gliders it is now much safer to perform than before...
Nice vid Bernd!
WTF Pal, it seems on the movie that you made tumbling to tumbling connection but it seems that you didnt have much energy but the glider was really stable. It starts at 2:51 s from exiting the helicopter. Did you used some rythmic technique to make few turns ? because i dont see hand at first shot
Well, unfortunately I don't have lot's of footage yet, so I just uploaded my first solo run from the Freestyleair comp. I screwed up the twister, but the rest was ok... :-) Sorry, but the footage is totally unedited...
Infinity - MistyHelico - Twister - switchy Tumbles and two "bonus" tricks, dyn full stall and misty.
Need to get some more airtime, but the weather is getting crap around here :-)
yeah, give us some videos Pal! Like the Madeira video really showed and promoted the morpheus in action. Reading it on a forum from your perspective is far more effective than the jargon on U-Turns website...Although I already have FLX2, my curiosity I'm sure is the same with others and like you say 'a step forward', this is what all acro wings should pursue. Looking forward to some clips of you and Gabor, especially helico connections etc.
Well honestly, I cannot tell you how good all those systems and innovations work, or what would happen if I would just close all those openings (EAS) if I would feel a difference at all or if it would work the same. Maybe flying without all those openings the difference wouldn't be really noticable on the handling, and stability is hard to measure anyway, you just feel it. But what I can definitely tell you is that the PPS works extremely good in acro, not to mention the outstanding starting behaviour of the glider, which was really not the case with the G-Force...The Thriller is just easier to handle for all tricks, brakes are lighter, the forces on the pilot are shallower, however the wing is still nice dynamic. Helico connections are smooth, only rythmic takes 1 or 2 turns longer to reach the vertical angle, but therefore nice stable without loosing much pressure and for me it does the best infinity, because the rotation is slow and gentle, you don't suffer from high G-Forces like with the Morpheus and at the same time the flow of the figure and the movements of the glider are much nicer.
Anyway for me it's a fact that the glider does very well, it can be either all those small details combined together with a new, good profile. The glider is now finished and is already in serial production, but we are waiting for further prototypes with a lot bigger EAS openings to find out how big of a factor it really plays in the overall performance of the wing. However in my eyes it is definitely a step forward in the progress of technology - for sure not a step back, even if it doesn't work so fantastic.
I will hopefully find the time to throw up some videos soon...
Give it a try!
Cheers,
Pál
It sounds fantastic, doesn't it... I would like to hear more from other pilots about this wing, I don't think I'm convinced by all the fancy abbreviations such as [EAS+AFS+PPN] and all the other talk, well, not from a company that gave me the incorrect risers, then couldn't give me the correct line sets, twice in the post for my morpheus- therefore does make me wonder if these are such innovations such as Ozones BBHPP comp. wing that cleaned up PWC, or if they are just a marketing ploy...? Well, if there really is a big difference, then hats off to those involved(U-Turn team) for the effort to make more and progress acro design/technology :-)
the thriller is a bit easier to fly than the old gforce. it shoots not so hard. bit its more dynamic than the morpheus. its like a thing between these two gliders.
it has a lower aspect ratio than the old gforce. it also has a lot of closed cells and some stopcocks on the top! also the stabilo is quite closed.
all in all, it looks really nice! some friends of me tested the glider yet and they are really impressed!
Latest Comments
Thanks Martin.
Interesting..
Gene
i had a phone with them last week but thomas only told me about a 26m² for paramotor nothing about a 24m².....
martin
Pal, Gabor.
Do you have an idea when Thriller 24m2 comes out ?
Gene
Would they consider making a 19m2 for those that want perfect wing loading?
@ Joerg: I fly the 17m2 with 90 kg take-off weight (but I could easily fly a bigger one too).
Ricky Kahn flies a 20m2 Thriller with about 105 kg take-off weight and does perfect Rythmic SATs, Infinities!
Go for the biggest size possible, you will have fun and learn safer/faster/easier than with a smaller, aggressiver glider!
@Idiot: I just had a PPG show on the weekend, flying a 22m2 Thriller. This gives me about the same kg/m2 as flying the 17m2 solo (my motor with rescue and petrol weights about 40 kg). It was so much fun, but I was only doing the basics tricks like WO, SAT, helicopter. I did many helico to helicos too, hihihi, I guess it was never done with paramotor before :-)
Anyhow, as soon as the 24m2 comes out I think I will take that one because there is really no need for the small size, since it is dynamic enough anyway...For the Paramotor version there probably must be some small changes like a longer trimmer for better speeds on straight flights.
ciao
It is such a good news.
I'm ~140 kg all up and there is no free style glider in the market for PPG pilots.
I can use smaller gliders but they simply do not have the high G capacity.
You guys can give a lot of feedback to manufacturers, please let them know that we do not have a PPG free style glider in the market.
Thanks again
Alex
Thanks for the answer!
So is my interpretation correct that flying the 22m2 with 120kg is totally over the top? That would mean that other gliders like the Supersonic, the Nikita or the RR wings are small for me, too? What a shame...
cheers, joerg
Hi!
Just have a little patience and soon the Thriller 24m2 will come out! It is gonna be just the perfect toy for pilots with some basics acro experience and heavier guys to fly radical stuff but safe!
There are some small new developments in the inner structure of the canopy to make it even stronger and give longer life to the wing.
Yeeeehaw!
Hi.
I've got an answer and since over 2 month I fly my thriller 20 :). I can only say I love this wing !!! My first acro glider
and feels like I made a great choice but... it concerns ONLY myself.Some of the best acro pilots seen my films and my skill's level so was much easier to get a good advice.Also my learning ability is quite high and I knew I will manage . I guess it's difficult to give any advice without seeing pilot in the air...What I can say I will recommend thriller for guys they fly basic acro manouvers well including FULL STALLS( very well)!!!
If it comes to the size...well,trust your feelings and skills :)
Hope it helps.Good luck/Blaze
Hi,
at what wing load do you guys fly the thriller (or other acro gliders)?
I'm a tall guy and have around 118kg takeoff weight. Looking at the wing load tables that is too much for all the acro gliders out there... or are those tables on the safe side to make less experienced pilots choose bigger gliders?
cheers,
joerg
Blaze,
did anybody answer your question? I'm trying to decide what next wing should be for me, and I want to start doing some acro also.
thanks
Hi guys,
I found on U-turn's website this table of wing loading:
http://www.u-turn.de/site/gs/assets/thriller/pdf/EN//Table_of_area_loadi...
It says that even in the grey range the wing is able to perform the infinity tumbling. Is it really possible?
My take off weight is about 100 kg and I'm considering the Thriller in size 22 (wing loading would be 4,55-4,77 kg/m^2) but only if it would be possible to do the infinity tumbling.
On Icaro's website you can read that the Nikita II is able to make all today's manoeuvres when the wing loading is at least 5 kg/m^2.
Can someone experienced answer - what is the minimal wing loading necessary for the infinity?
Thx :)
PS. bernd - how do you find the Thriller compared to the Morpheus II? Is it more dynamic? How's the helico on M II?
Hi Fabio,
Don't worry, the Thriller is 100% Aramid (Kevlar). Possibly the brakes are Dyneema - but that should be OK.
All the best brother,
Bernd ;)
Thanks Mike,
I still work for them, but anyway I would like to have the answer from people who's actually flying, then I can compare with what the "official word" says. I saw Bernd's Yellow/Grey Morpheus 2, and he says it have complete Kevlar Lineset. This tells me something... Or not? Someone who flew both versions (Dyneema and Kevlar), could tell me something? Thanks and best regards to all!
.)(.
____________________________________
Fábio Barretto Fava - Xtreme Paragliding
http://xtremeparagliding.com/
fabiofava@xtremeparagliding.com
The above e-mail is my MSN address
Fabio> I thought you were sponsored or at least had a lot to do with U-turn? Surely you speak to Ernst directly?
Do they still use dyneema lines on this glider? After all the troubles with the morpheus? Cant imagine that! If so, its f***ing stupid!
I'm ordering a Thriller 18 for me, should I ask for special lines? What's the difference on the glider if I ask complete Kevlar line set? Will it be the same safety? More durable for stretching and shrinking? Thanks!
.)(.
____________________________________
Fábio Barretto Fava - Xtreme Paragliding
http://xtremeparagliding.com/
fabiofava@xtremeparagliding.com
The above e-mail is my MSN address
the glider looks (just looks!) a little bit like the good old twister.. isn't it? the long lines...the bend of the canopy.
:P
seeya :)
Hi David
Yo- I don't doubt it after this forum discussion, but if you had read from the beginning- I haven't had the best experiences from U-Turn which lead me to not believe in this product. 4sure It's been good to hear from pilots!! :-D
Hi mikesm08,
It's my footage you see on vimeo. I just want to try to explain my first feelings about the thriller . I did only 4 flights with it, but I'm already very impressed. First of all, I've usually many problems with helico, but with the thriller it's easier because the parachutage is very stable, and the wing stay always just above the head. For the rythmic, the brake is lighter than others acro wings and the glider keep high pressure, despite my low weight (65kg). I advise you to test it and you'll quickly understand that it's probably the best acro glider you have ever flown!
Pictures under www.acro-cat.ch
David
Thanx Pal and Bernd for the videos.
I found this on vimeo, it's not the best footage but you can see the shape of the wing, longer lines etc>
http://www.vimeo.com/7144599
It will definitely be interesting if the EAS evolves into something in the future...
Thanks Pal!
For that kind of answer I've been waiting for.It helps for sure.
Cheers
Hi!
If you already have some basic acro experience I would definitely suggest you to try a 22m2 version of the Thriller! It will have the same characteristics like an acro glider (easy handling, great dynamics, blabla), but without the agression of it. The dynamic figures are never a problem, they will only get much much easier for you. But you need to re-learn to perform nice full-stalls cleanly! First learn to make perfecft tail-slides with your current glider and it's going fine, you are ready to move up and adopt your skills on an acro glider in the beginning over water.
Hope that helps...
Hi guys!
I really hope you are not gonna say"F..ck,another one again" ;D but my question is if the Thriller might be good as a first acro glider.Since two seasons I fly Sigma 6 and I do really high and clean wingovers ,SAT with no flapping wingtips and asymetric spiral. I don't know so much about acro yet ;) but I don't want to jump on 2 hot wing from the beginning like G-force or Morpheus is.Where the Thriller is placed compare to those?
Thanks for understanding to a rookie :))).Regards
Very nice synchro video. I know the switchy tumbling is nothing new but i think its a rare stuff to see in acro videos thats why i was impressed. Need to try this one on my Nikita :-)
Jarek
www.flyordie.info
There is another one, synchro this time, unfortunately without helico action.
Both Tumblings were quite nicely synchronized, thanks to that now is flying one m2 bigger than I.
Next time when I have the possibility I'll record an only-helico-to-helico training flight... ;-)
Till then:
http://www.justacro.com/video/justacro/freestyleair-2nd-synchro-run
After the helico exit when I enter the first tumbling I use no rythmic moves (I didn't want to make it too high, because wanted to exit in classical way to enter the second one), I only release the brake back up a bit, not to loose energy. It easily does 2-3 turns, if you don't pull too much brake. Coming out from the first one I already have more energy for the second, so I am able to wait longer to enter and then I used some rythmic to get it straight up and exit symmetric, like from an infinity. It is called switchy tumbling and it is not a new thing, however with nowadays acro gliders it is now much safer to perform than before...
Nice vid Bernd!
WTF Pal, it seems on the movie that you made tumbling to tumbling connection but it seems that you didnt have much energy but the glider was really stable. It starts at 2:51 s from exiting the helicopter. Did you used some rythmic technique to make few turns ? because i dont see hand at first shot
Impressive canopy stable and flying of course :-)
Jarek
www.flyordie.info
I have another uncut video from training in summer.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8cqdFf6YUEA
The Thriller has very well-balanced allround flight characteristics and feels very smooth during all the maneuvers and bla bla bla...
Just try it out and smile... -Bernd ;)
Well, unfortunately I don't have lot's of footage yet, so I just uploaded my first solo run from the Freestyleair comp. I screwed up the twister, but the rest was ok... :-) Sorry, but the footage is totally unedited...
Infinity - MistyHelico - Twister - switchy Tumbles and two "bonus" tricks, dyn full stall and misty.
Need to get some more airtime, but the weather is getting crap around here :-)
http://www.vimeo.com/7027352
yeah, give us some videos Pal! Like the Madeira video really showed and promoted the morpheus in action. Reading it on a forum from your perspective is far more effective than the jargon on U-Turns website...Although I already have FLX2, my curiosity I'm sure is the same with others and like you say 'a step forward', this is what all acro wings should pursue. Looking forward to some clips of you and Gabor, especially helico connections etc.
H!
Well honestly, I cannot tell you how good all those systems and innovations work, or what would happen if I would just close all those openings (EAS) if I would feel a difference at all or if it would work the same. Maybe flying without all those openings the difference wouldn't be really noticable on the handling, and stability is hard to measure anyway, you just feel it. But what I can definitely tell you is that the PPS works extremely good in acro, not to mention the outstanding starting behaviour of the glider, which was really not the case with the G-Force...The Thriller is just easier to handle for all tricks, brakes are lighter, the forces on the pilot are shallower, however the wing is still nice dynamic. Helico connections are smooth, only rythmic takes 1 or 2 turns longer to reach the vertical angle, but therefore nice stable without loosing much pressure and for me it does the best infinity, because the rotation is slow and gentle, you don't suffer from high G-Forces like with the Morpheus and at the same time the flow of the figure and the movements of the glider are much nicer.
Anyway for me it's a fact that the glider does very well, it can be either all those small details combined together with a new, good profile. The glider is now finished and is already in serial production, but we are waiting for further prototypes with a lot bigger EAS openings to find out how big of a factor it really plays in the overall performance of the wing. However in my eyes it is definitely a step forward in the progress of technology - for sure not a step back, even if it doesn't work so fantastic.
I will hopefully find the time to throw up some videos soon...
Give it a try!
Cheers,
Pál
http://www.u-turn.de/site/rahmen.php?next=07_01.php&sprache=en&kat=gs
It sounds fantastic, doesn't it... I would like to hear more from other pilots about this wing, I don't think I'm convinced by all the fancy abbreviations such as [EAS+AFS+PPN] and all the other talk, well, not from a company that gave me the incorrect risers, then couldn't give me the correct line sets, twice in the post for my morpheus- therefore does make me wonder if these are such innovations such as Ozones BBHPP comp. wing that cleaned up PWC, or if they are just a marketing ploy...? Well, if there really is a big difference, then hats off to those involved(U-Turn team) for the effort to make more and progress acro design/technology :-)
hey,
the thriller is a bit easier to fly than the old gforce. it shoots not so hard. bit its more dynamic than the morpheus. its like a thing between these two gliders.
it has a lower aspect ratio than the old gforce. it also has a lot of closed cells and some stopcocks on the top! also the stabilo is quite closed.
all in all, it looks really nice! some friends of me tested the glider yet and they are really impressed!
maybe i can test it this week...
greets simon